Thundercats Ep 13 - Between Brothers Discussion

[AdamofEternia]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balgus82

they'd have to do something more severe than that for me to stop watching. though if they had her switch to lion-o in just a couple episodes I'd be pissed because that would be just as out of the blue as her choosing tygra seemed to be and would be a poor reflection on her and just plain bad writing.

if she does end up with lion-o (and im not saying wither she will or she won't) it should be more gradual. stay with tygra a while, then be by herself a while, and then go to lion-o.

since they made the decision to have her with tygra, they should just leave it at that. any more back and forth with brothers would make her look much worse than she already looks to some of the fans here. all we can hope for now is for better writing and more focus on the main story arc.

[L08e16o]

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdamofEternia

maybe they didn't want to let us know cheetara harbored feelings for tygra.

I think they would have said she had feelings for tygra. This is after E13. It would be safe to say it.

[cmangund]

Quote:

Originally Posted by L08e16o

How many people get over someone that meant a lot to them.

As we know, cheetara is the first female that made him feel that way.

He can get over it, but he would be reminded every day when he sees T/C.

It will "torture" Lion-O's heart and mind.

[L08e16o]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balgus82

yeah. I mean I will go on record saying I don't think the situation was handled well. They should've given both brothers equal time (or close to it) with her so that it didn't seem like it came out of nowhere. I understand why L/C people are frustrated.

But some of the things that are said about cheetara and the absolute hatred of tygra are things I don't agree with.

Both brothers have been jerks to each other. it's not Tygra's sole domain.

It is mostly tygra, face it.

All lion-o did was be a jerk about cheetara without knowing about the flower.

[Balgus82]

Quote:

Originally Posted by L08e16o

That is isn't sexist. In the context of the story, male or female, she is tided to lion-o. Her purpose is as cleric first.

What is her purpose if she can't do her first job?

I would be happy if the writers would have stayed course.

If she didn't chose either, than she would be staying true to her purpose as a cleric.

again. clerics are bodyguards. her "first job" as you put it isn't to be his girlfriend. it's to guard his life.

[cmangund]

Quote:

Originally Posted by L08e16o

I think they would have said she had feelings for tygra. This is after E13. It would be safe to say it.

Cause it won't be a spoiier if they said it it's fact now. They can't because it either an illusion or something more complex such as feelings and/or duty.

[L08e16o]

Quote:

Originally Posted by stormbringer

If indeed the show does go with T/C (which I doubt given the last minute rush job to put them together), then Cheetara will have no one but herself to blame for Lion-o's lack of trust in her. After leading him on, intentionaly or not , and seeing her in a liplock with his brother, she will have totally undermined her credibility as a friend or advisor.

You are correct.

[L08e16o]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balgus82

I think something people aren't considering is that for Lion-O to grow there has to be setbacks. He has to loose sometimes. You don't grow if you always win. He has to be able to rise above it and he will become a better king by learning how to overcome adversity than he would by getting everything he wants.

The guys has been losing his whole life. Gosh.

[L08e16o]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balgus82

I believe (and of course it's only my opinion) that Tygra will soften towards Lion-O a little since he has Cheetara. I think she will be a good influence on him. Lion-O, of course, won't get over her easily so that'll definitely still cause friction between them. But it's early in the show still. they need setbacks. if they get all buddy-buddy this soon, what do they have to learn the rest of the series? two steps forward, one step backward.

I'm hoping they'll reconcile a bit by the end of the next 13 episodes. then after that they can work on learning to work more closely with each other better.

How will he soften on him. His whole issue with lion-o is the crown, not cheetara.

So lion-o has to suck it up while tygra is rewarded for his behavior.

[Balgus82]

Quote:

Originally Posted by L08e16o

The guys has been losing his whole life. Gosh.

what has he lost that tygra hasn't?

[cmangund]

Quote:

Originally Posted by L08e16o

How will he soften on him. His whole issue with lion-o is the crown, not cheetara.

So lion-o has to suck it up while tygra is rewarded for his behavior.

Cheetara is the second thing to Tygra as he said "Just like the sword another thing you don't deserve!" Tygra seeing her as a "thing", its fact.

[L08e16o]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balgus82

exactly. thats still 39 episodes to go. that's a lot of time. lots can change before the end. she could break up with tygra, go stag for a season, and then eventually end up with Lion-O. Or she could stay with Tygra and it could end up for the best. or she could break with Tygra and end up with neither. we don't know yet.

either way the development of the characters isn't solely dependent on who's someone's girlfriend.

I think we are missing the bigger picture. She has to work with lion-o. One episode will not help.

Trust is important, it can take a long time to heal or have someone trust you again.

[Balgus82]

Quote:

Originally Posted by L08e16o

How will he soften on him. His whole issue with lion-o is the crown, not cheetara.

So lion-o has to suck it up while tygra is rewarded for his behavior.

did you watch any part of between brothers other than the last 2 minutes? tygra had lion-o beat. if he really wanted the crown so bad he could've easily had it. what did he do? he let it go, and the sword disappeared from his hands.

[L08e16o]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmangund

Cheetara is the second thing to Tygra as he said "Just like the sword another thing you don't deserve!"

Thank you. Can't see how anyone could like someone like that.

He is always competing with lion-o.

[Balgus82]

Quote:

Originally Posted by L08e16o

I think we are missing the bigger picture. She has to work with lion-o. One episode will not help.

Trust is important, it can take a long time to heal or have someone trust you again.

i still don't understand why you assume lion-o no longer trusts cheetara when we haven't seen any scene after the kiss.

[DarkKnight]

hey cmangund lion-o just earned an achievement: bonner of omens

[L08e16o]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmangund

Yeah and even IF they will not tie the Cheetara connection with the triangle (which is highly unlikely, considering all the data) then we are back to the basic analysis of her in a deadlock, cannot choosing between the brothers, even if after she has chosen either one of them then knowing she is hurting the other brother's feeling and vice cersa as in this scenario http://www.thundercats.ws/thundercat.../19/#post24312 because that's her character.

That is fine if she does not choose. As you know, it is this rush job for 5 minutes.

She is a cleric first, she has to work with lion-o no matter what.

[cmangund]

Quote:

Originally Posted by L08e16o

That is fine if she does not choose. As you know, it is this rush job for 5 minutes.

She is a cleric first, she has to work with lion-o no matter what.

Agreed. I am just seeing all angle including the worst.

[DarkKnight]

I agree but all we can do now is hope for the best

[cmangund]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkKnight

hey cmangund lion-o just earned an achievement: bonner of omens

Keep adding more Lion-O/Cheetara moments from episodes, it helps with the four musketeers thinking!

[L08e16o]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balgus82

i still don't understand why you assume lion-o no longer trusts cheetara when we haven't seen any scene after the kiss.

I don't know if you are a female or male, but I am a male.

If cheetara would have done everything she did to lion-o as he did to me, I would think she is into me.

She should have approach lion-o first and let him down, if that what she wanted to do. As we know she didn't.

Basically she went behind his back. She was not honest with him to begin with.

I like cheetara too.

[Balgus82]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmangund

Cheetara is the second thing to Tygra as he said "Just like the sword another thing you don't deserve!" Tygra seeing her as a "thing", its fact.

that's just semantics. it wouldn't have sounded right if he had said "just like the sword another person you don't deserve" now would it?

what I don't understand though is why some people seem to think that his jealousy for lion-o having the crown and his jealousy over cheetara can't exist without the other. you're going "he's only jealous over cheetara because lion-o has the crown" and that just doesn't make any sense. they're two different things. is he also jealous over lion-o's clothes because he has the crown? his haircut? he's not jealous over everything lion-o has, just the crown and the girl. and cheetara and the crown are not joined together.

[stormbringer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmangund

Cause it won't be a spoiier if they said it it's fact now. They can't because it either an illusion or something more complex such as feelings and/or duty.

Illusion is one of the best ways to go, unless we want to use the real world explanation. Bad writing.

[L08e16o]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Snarf

Which is why i think pumyra will be older in this series because she may have to be the mother figure that holds the group together.

But she only gets 3 episodes.

[cmangund]

Quote:

Originally Posted by L08e16o

If cheetara would have done everything she did to lion-o as he did to me, I would think she is into me.

She should have approach lion-o first and let him down, if that what she wanted to do. As we know she didn't.

Basically she went behind his back. She was not honest with him to begin with.

Agreed. Unless there's alot more to that then meets the eye: our discussions and theories mostly!

[Balgus82]

Quote:

Originally Posted by L08e16o

I don't know if you are a female or male, but I am a male.

If cheetara would have done everything she did to lion-o as he did to me, I would think she is into me.

She should have approach lion-o first and let him down, if that what she wanted to do. As we know she didn't.

Basically she went behind his back. She was not honest with him to begin with.

I like cheetara too.

I think she went to Tygra first because when you realize the person you like is actually into you too you go to them. she didn't know lion-o was there watching her.

[cmangund]

Quote:

Originally Posted by L08e16o

But she only gets 3 episodes.

Not necessarily 3 he said a couple episodes.

[L08e16o]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balgus82

that's just semantics. it wouldn't have sounded right if he had said "just like the sword another person you don't deserve" now would it?

what I don't understand though is why some people seem to think that his jealousy for lion-o having the crown and his jealousy over cheetara can't exist without the other. you're going "he's only jealous over cheetara because lion-o has the crown" and that just doesn't make any sense. they're two different things. is he also jealous over lion-o's clothes because he has the crown? his haircut? he's not jealous over everything lion-o has, just the crown and the girl. and cheetara and the crown are not joined together.

Take off the tygra glasses. If tygra was not jealous of lion-o he would have accepted L/C. Because he doesn't like to lose to lion-o which stems from the crown, that was what drove him.

[Balgus82]

Quote:

Originally Posted by stormbringer

Illusion is one of the best ways to go, unless we want to use the real world explanation. Bad writing.

i'm going with bad writing. it's like some people don't like what happened so they're trying to come up with wild theories so they can pretend it didn't happen.

in my eyes. she chose tygra. the writers handled it badly. and if they say a magical illusion or spell or something was the reason it happened, then that'll be bad writing too. it would just be a cop out.

[Balgus82]

Quote:

Originally Posted by L08e16o

Take off the tygra glasses. If tygra was not jealous of lion-o he would have accepted L/C. Because he doesn't like to lose to lion-o which stems from the crown, that was what drove him.

I never said tygra wasn't jealous. what I said was that his jealousy for the crown and his jealousy for cheetara were not one big jealousy but two separate jealousies.

[cmangund]

Quote:

Originally Posted by L08e16o

Take off the tygra glasses. If tygra was not jealous of lion-o he would have accepted L/C. Because he doesn't like to lose to lion-o which stems from the crown, that was what drove him.

Don't forget, Tygra has enough all the time in the world to start or trying to start a proper relationship with Cheetara and Vice Versa before Cheetara and Lion-O things happened. But they didn't, its fact.

[L08e16o]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmangund

Of course some of T/C fans will leave, but most will not cause it's in perfect equal scale evolved triangle. Most of us were okay with it right before this dreaded Ep13. Even the TCL board are okay or "okay" with the Lion-O/Cheetarat thing. Now it's similar situation again only this time there is Cheetara/Tygra thing in the equation. knowing WB this could highly be the likely scenario too, so its either the:

1 +1/-1 x Illusions theories + Cheetara SoO Connection(http://www.thundercats.ws/thundercat.../36/#post25947) x Not tied to the triangle + this similar scenario: http://www.thundercats.ws/thundercat.../32/#post25467 = Ep 14 "New Alliances"
OR
2. +1/-1 x Illusions theories + Cheeatara SoO Connection(http://www.thundercats.ws/thundercat.../36/#post25947) x tied to the triangle with Lion-O/Cheetara happening = Ep 14 "New Alliances"

Illusion would clear up a lot of vague comments.

[Balgus82]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmangund

Not necessarily 3 he said a couple episodes.

actually i think the word used in the interview was "several," but i'd have to double check.

yup. "You'll see Pumyra, with several episodes devoted to her, even if our take on her is not the same as in the original series"

http://www.awn.com/articles/thunderc...nic/page/4%2C1

[DarkKnight]

The decision she made is still inconclusive why , but the voice actors are giving us little hints about L/C so lets not argue amongst ourselves. We should be DISCUSSING this, not arguing.

[L08e16o]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmangund

It will "torture" Lion-O's heart and mind.

I telling you he won't be able to use the sword.

[cmangund]

Quote:

Originally Posted by L08e16o

Illusion would clear up a lot of vague comments.

Yup definetly that's why I added +1 or -1 on Illusions.

[cmangund]

"You'll see Pumyra, with several episodes devoted to her, even if our take on her is not the same as in the original series. That's our attitude for all these characters. We're thinking, like, "How can we work Safari Joe into this episode?" That's one reason that in episode five, the Driller showed up, just because he was one of the more popular villains from the old series. It's a bit of a balancing act figuring out where and how we're going to use these characters."

[DarkKnight]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balgus82

I think she went to Tygra first because when you realize the person you like is actually into you too you go to them. she didn't know lion-o was there watching her.

but she dosen;t lik tygra like she does lion-o. I read an article that said " tygra and cheetara SUPRISINGLY agreed on something".

[cmangund]

Quote:

Originally Posted by L08e16o

I telling you he won't be able to use the sword.

Yes that too. that's why I also said strong possiblity the Cheetara/SoO/Lion-O Connections theory tied to the triangle will come true as in the latest equation I posted.

[DarkKnight]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balgus82

I think she went to Tygra first because when you realize the person you like is actually into you too you go to them. she didn't know lion-o was there watching her.

but she dosent like tygra like she does lion-o. I read an article that said " tygra and cheetara SUPRISINGLY agreed on something".

[L08e16o]

Again, my whole problem is the writing with L/C 1-12. If that was T/C, I wouldn't have said anything.

They did such a good job of building L/C, he made really wan to watch the show for that plot too.

[stormbringer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by L08e16o

I telling you he won't be able to use the sword.

Well, if the sword is bonded to Lion-o's psyche, it would certainly place the cats in a vulnerable position right now. They'd better hope Mumm-ra doesn't find out.

[cmangund]

Quote:

Originally Posted by L08e16o

Again, my whole problem is the writing with L/C 1-12. If that was T/C, I wouldn't have said anything.

They did such a good job of building L/C, he made really wan to watch the show for that plot too.

I think that's proof that the writer succeded in building the Lion-O/Cheetara romance. Otherwise the 4 musketeers will not be born last year. And the survey results mostly criticizing the 180 switch Lion-O/Cheetara fans or not, with most Lion-O/Chetara fans angry and wanting to drop the show or at the verge of dropping the show, That and other interviews, facts and data also the reason why I believe Lion-O/Cheetara willl happen. Of course despite all of taht I always like to be prepared for the worst possiblity of dropping the show, thus" attacking" this darn problem form all angle possible.

[Balgus82]

Quote:

Originally Posted by L08e16o

Again, my whole problem is the writing with L/C 1-12. If that was T/C, I wouldn't have said anything.

They did such a good job of building L/C, he made really wan to watch the show for that plot too.

I agree it was written badly. I'm just trying to take what happened at the end of episode 13 at face value instead of trying to explain it away.

[DarkKnight]

I just realized T/C has a lot of screen time. excuse me...............................@################ ^&(*) !@$%.

[L08e16o]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balgus82

I never said tygra wasn't jealous. what I said was that his jealousy for the crown and his jealousy for cheetara were not one big jealousy but two separate jealousies.

If you go to a psychologist or doctor, they will find the root of your problem.

The root of all tygra's jealousy is lion-o being king.

He said it himself, you will always finish second.

[L08e16o]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balgus82

I agree it was written badly. I'm just trying to take what happened at the end of episode 13 at face value instead of trying to explain it away.

Thanks.

We are trying to figure out the different angles using all the clues out there.

I am OS fan, I have always wanted T/P together.

[L08e16o]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmangund

I think that's proof that the writer succeded in building the Lion-O/Cheetara romance. Otherwise the 4 musketeers will not be born last year. That and other interviews, facts and data also the reason why I believe Lion-O/Cheetara willl happen. Of course despite all of taht I always like to be prepared for the worst possiblity of dropping the show.

Agreed.

If they had switch places L/C with T/C. I would have been fine with it.

I think that is what some tygra fans don't understand.

We are more upset with the writing then the characters.

[Balgus82]

Quote:

Originally Posted by L08e16o

If you go to a psychologist or doctor, they will find the root of your problem.

The root of all tygra's jealousy is lion-o being king.

He said it himself, you will always finish second.

i'll give an example to hopefully explain it to you better.

i'm a little jealous of my brother's family. I though i'd have a family by now, but I'm still single.

I'm also jealous that my parents listen to and respect my brother more than me.

but I am not jealous of my brother's family because my parents respect him more. they're two different things.

[L08e16o]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balgus82

I think she went to Tygra first because when you realize the person you like is actually into you too you go to them. she didn't know lion-o was there watching her.

I don't believe cheetara would have done that.

If you like someone you give them hints, like how cheetara was with lion-o.

You don't risk losing a person you like with those type of actions.

Cheetara is a good cat, that is not how she is. I don't believe she was playing lion-o, I believe she likes lion-o.