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Old 05-10-2012, 09:06 AM   #401
L08e16o
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Originally Posted by AnonymousIncognito View Post
Jaga didn't decide that, the Spirit Stone did. Besides, Jaga and Lion-O were both already dead when Lion-O offered his sould. Both Jaga and Cheetara were very much alive when Jaga tested Cheetara's patience.

You compare apples to oranges and expect to get strawberries Balgus.
Not to mention, the stakes were a lot higher for lion-o. He fails they die. If cheetara fails, she doesn't become a cleric.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:10 AM   #402
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My response was more about calling attention to some of the logic behind some of the post I've read. No she isnt real, but responses like "Lion-O did more" are silly, degrading and archaic. Unfortunatley, I've come across people who really think giving a woman "gifts" earns you a right to her affections. Why not use a cartoon to teach others a little something about equality and fairness? ((ugg, please don't find me pretentious, I'm at work ))
I wasnt really trying to make a case for how is was written, nor was I trying to give my personal opionion on how it was written/fits into this story. Just that "Lion-O did more, and so he deserves her" is gross. Basing an arguement around, .."but he did more" is imo, silly.
If she chose Lion-O over Tygra, then complaints like "...but Tygra helped her into the clericy, she should have chosen him" would be just as disturbing 0.o

Did it fail???? I can only recall one conversation between Pumyra and Cheetara, and that was at the begininng of COR. Are you talking about the OS? The Smurfette Principle seems to be a shoe in

Wait, posts along the lines of: ""Lion-O did more" are silly, degrading and archaic" but posts like "Lion-O got the Sword and Crown so tygra should get Cheetara" aren't? And I've seen plenty of posts along the lines of "Lion-O got the Sword and Crown so Tygra should get Cheetara beacuse that's fair" from you and others who ship Tygra so why the double standard?
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:11 AM   #403
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The one thing that still confuses me about Cheetara's confession (besides the whole flower/clericy thing which i felt was the reason she liked him, with the way it was worded) was that she said she knew what had happened in there and how she should have been clearer with her feelings. If she knew what was going on why did she even choose either of them? Neither of them treated her right.

And it's the Bechdel test, BTW.

The Smurfette Principle; a female character strictly for demographic appeal but make no real attempt to treat her as an interesting character in her own right, outside of her relationships with the male characters. Which is sadly all i've seen of Cheetara so far.

The answer is simple. Plot hole.

Or as DN likes to spew as an excuse "unused plot device"
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:13 AM   #404
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ok, fair enough, then I agree.

As to Cheetara/Lion-o, I think that's a little unfair for two reasons. One, Lion-o is the main guy, pretty much anything with him is always gonna be about him, so you're basically saying he cant have a relationship on the show.

And secondly, in a 'these characters are real' sense, Lion-o is a KING (in the absolute monarch/divine right to rule sense of the word). This is something that modern social theories, especially ones about equality, can't really take into account. His world, and his people, are about him basically. He has no equal. Barring political changes that a kid's cartoon is unlikely to cover, they CANNOT be his equal. Their relationship, like every other relationship Lion-o will ever have, will always be defined by his position and his authority.

Brilliant reply KaleRylan!
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:14 AM   #405
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I wouldn't mind seeing a time jump actually, see Lion O full grown bad@$$ lion. right now he's still kinda scrawny...


Ehhh, can't agree with that. Too much potential for the writers to make the show even more like that garbage WS/DC ceries released.

And they are doing enough of that already.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:15 AM   #406
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Who else here thinks "AnonymousIncognito" IS Nick? He sure is replying a million posts in a row just like him.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:16 AM   #407
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That is debatable.

1. Jaga wanted her to learn patience. She failed the initial test due to her lack of it. Sitting on the steps to near death could be pointed out as enough reason to allow her in.

2. It could be argued that it is not within Jaga's nature to leave her to die on the steps thus he would have brought her in even without the flower.

3. Tygra didn't know anything about the properties so he had no way of knowing it would help or not.

4. Considering how easily replacable the characters are, it doesn't strike me as any kind of defining moment. Simply because it just as easily could have been Lion-o giving her the flower.

5. Sounds like you are trying to make brownie points with DN by parroting the poor excuses DN used on FB. Are you by chance that Phillip person I see also commenting on FB?
It's not debatable. Tygra's gift allowed her to sit on those steps for days, is this not what she said at the end of 13? What does Jaga have to do with this?Who knows what Jaga would have done, not that it really matter as far as the flower goes.
Tygra's gift helped nourish her during her stint on the steps. We don't know what Jaga would have done, but we do know she was out there for a long time without any food or water.
Tygra giving her a flower is not what makes this Cheetara's defining moment. The audience get's to see that she will do anything to make her dreams of becoming a Cleric a reality.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:16 AM   #408
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They kind of did do that in this episode, Lion-O wishes her well in her mission and even with Pumyra's teasing he insists he's over his crush. Judging by his face as she leaves I'd say that he was telling the truth, and his first answer to her question of if he likes her is a solid "No."

That said, I don't nessecarily thing Tygra is over the whole triangle thing, as he gives his brother a little stink-eye as he walks away. It'll be interesting to see what happens if Lion-O and Pumyra do form a close relationship.

Remember, according to Daniel Norton, there never really was a love triangle, it was all just misleading the viewers.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:16 AM   #409
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Who else here thinks "AnonymousIncognito" IS Nick? He sure is replying a million posts in a row just like him.
Almost certain.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:17 AM   #410
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Ummm, no it's not Balgus.
That is just a plain lie. I copy/pasted what Dan said directly from the thread. Just because I didn't post his replies to "Nick"'s attacks doesn't mean He didn't say what I quoted.

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Sorry balgus but according to DN, there never was a triangle, Tygra and not Jaga was solely responsible for Cheetara becoming a cleric and Lion-O is just Cheetara's 9-5 job.
No he said the audience was mislead.

A triangle is when two people like one person and you don't know who she'll chose between them. It does NOT mean she's in love with both people. That's just ridiculous.

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Old 05-10-2012, 09:20 AM   #411
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Every single interaction they have does not have to be about Lion-O. Majority is a given, but all of it?
Yes he is a King, but the way the relationship is presented on the show does not have to depict complete and total dominant/submissive. That's why I think I'll be a bit more open to a relationship between L/P . Crush or not, I don't think I'll have to see her just turn her head down if Lion-O does something wrong. I understand he is the ruler, but I just don't want to see it portrayed that way. It wont be any fun for ME. I personally wont like it. The writers can depict their realtionships how ever they please, but that doesnt mean I will like it
We've seen Lion-O in a supportive role before. Why cant we see him do that in a romantic relationship as well? It would be a nice insight to his character.

Considering the show is supposedly from Lion-O's perspective, it makes perfect sense concerning the interactions.

The way it's presented on the show is Lion-O is king, he makes a decision and everyone complains, inults, and questions him.
The reason we haven't seen any insight into lion-O's character in that way is because the writers want to keep him second to Tygra in all things except the crown and sword.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:21 AM   #412
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I actually agree. I liked how they handled it in this episode, I just left it out to shorten the post.

I agree kind of about Tygra. I think he's gonna have to go through a second phase of understanding about his brother. His first phase was dealing with the stuff that couldn't be helped; blood, sword, crown, etc. But he dealt with that partially by assuring himself that he WAS the better man, even if he couldn't have the crown.

That's going to change when Lion-o actually matures into a confident, powerful warrior and king, and a good man. Tygra is going to have to come to terms with the fact that he's not just a better man than his brother. He's going to need to find something that defines him instead of rating himself by Lion-o. That will be the second phase.

And I think it's only after that that we'll see them actually have a good relationship.

99% agreed. I thought the episode could have been much better.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:21 AM   #413
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Working for a small business that turns enough of a profit to pay out 2.5 million a year for 26 employees is stressful. In order to keep pay rates up like that, logically you're employees have to average well over $100k a year profit per person. That's a lot of responsibility, enough to make people vent about the extra little stresses in their lives. How many of the complainers that you work with complain about children's cartoons?

See, that's the thing. Thundercats is a kid's cartoon. It's not perfect, but it's much better fleshed out than the toy commercial that was the original series. For the most part, it's fun to watch. If anything upsets me, I just give it the benefit of the doubt, or write it off.
I am going to get in trouble here for saying it, but most of the people are middle aged. I am by far the youngest in my office.

The difference is they complain 9 hours a day. At least this is in a forum. I am sure if they watched cartons, they will complain. So people will never be happy.

I don't post on any other anime/cartoon forums. I grew up with TCats, so it kind of a childhood memory for me.

Other animes, I don't care about the ships. I care more about the story and character development.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:23 AM   #414
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Who else here thinks "AnonymousIncognito" IS Nick? He sure is replying a million posts in a row just like him.
LMAO

He is certainly copying and pasting the same things the AnonymousIncognito who is "that Nick guy" posted in other boards. Unless he stole the nickname and is stealing the words too...

So what is it? Do we have an impersonator, or a schizophrenic?
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:23 AM   #415
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I do kinda miss some of the insane crazyness you could only get with a half hour toy commercial. One episode would be Lion-O trying to save unicorns from cyborg vikings. Another would be Tygra and a Warrior maiden getting stuck invisible during a rescue mission. Half the cats taking the Thundertank undersea to help a walrus fight a giant robot. Mumm-Ra summons a samurai to mess Lion-O up. You just did not know what crazy thing was going to happen when you turned on the TV. Also the snazy theme.

It seems Tygra still hasn't gotten over his jelousy of Lion-O. Honestly though, Tygra really does not have anything to be jelous of. All bieng king has really given Lion-O is a ton of responsibilitys and problems. Other than those and a title, Tygra really has always gotten all the cream, while Lion-O has gotten all the trouble. Tygra needs to get over it fully, and support his brother, showing some actual charecter growth. Or at some point we will have to have Lion-O finally kick Tygra's ass.

Agree and agree. That is probably the biggest issie I had with tygra being paired with Cheetara. As was pointed out in that FB discussion with Daniel norton, Lion-O is the more nobel of the two and Cheetara seemed the type to go for noble. Same way I agree that the whole Tygra is in Lion-O's shadow" line to be garbage.

Tygra was never in Lion-O's shadow, Lion-O was always in his.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:25 AM   #416
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you know the only real complaints the show really has on it is the crappy@$$ romance and Tygra being a douchebag, beyond that the show's purely awesomesauce.

Again, I have to agree with you.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:29 AM   #417
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yeah, I agree Tygra still has some issues there, but I also don't believe LiOon's over her yet either. Yes, he is making a solid attempt but Cheetara's own words, "you can't help who your heart chooses", that cuts both ways, and the boy did fall pretty hard. I'm certain though Pumyra, judging by her recent actions, will do her best with helping him with that matter...

and yes, it would be most interesting on how it will play out if they do form a close relationship.
Agree. He said "No...Ye...I am over it...". He was going to say Yeah.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:36 AM   #418
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Considering the show is supposedly from Lion-O's perspective, it makes perfect sense concerning the interactions.

The way it's presented on the show is Lion-O is king, he makes a decision and everyone complains, inults, and questions him.
The reason we haven't seen any insight into lion-O's character in that way is because the writers want to keep him second to Tygra in all things except the crown and sword.
That is how I feel.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:40 AM   #419
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[QUOTE=Chique;49855]This is really just my personal preference, but basically this. I mean, the show might just turn Pumyra into a replacement cheerleader, and I wont like it.
Eh, don't want to give you the wrong impression with the dominant/submissive thing. I just don't want to see anyone really, just shot down because Lion-O is ruler and they must always obey."




Ummm, 2011 Panthro's Trial was resolved when Lion-O ordered him out of the ring. The whole point of that Trial was for Lion-O to learn that he is king and his word is absolute.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:43 AM   #420
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I am a lion-o fan. IMO, MJ has made tygra outshine lion-o.

I agree. it's kind of obvious that Tygra is the favorite character to the Crew and that they are making him Gary Stuish. Tygra is the Golden Child to them and Lion-O is the punching bag.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:45 AM   #421
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Not to mention, the stakes were a lot higher for lion-o. He fails they die. If cheetara fails, she doesn't become a cleric.

THANK YOU! Life would have gone on for Cheetara had she not become a cleric. Life would have ended for ALL the Thundercats had Lion-O not succeeded.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:45 AM   #422
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This is really just my personal preference, but basically this. I mean, the show might just turn Pumyra into a replacement cheerleader, and I wont like it.
Eh, don't want to give you the wrong impression with the dominant/submissive thing. I just don't want to see anyone really, just shot down because Lion-O is ruler and they must always obey."




Ummm, 2011 Panthro's Trial was resolved when Lion-O ordered him out of the ring. The whole point of that Trial was for Lion-O to learn that he is king and his word is absolute.
ummm, what don't you understand about personal preference? Come on man, I said as much in the post you quoted.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:48 AM   #423
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Who else here thinks "AnonymousIncognito" IS Nick? He sure is replying a million posts in a row just like him.


Actually Balgus, my name is Glenn Dawson.

So I'm not allowed to reply to posts on an open forum? Wow, you're as pathetic as Daniel Norton.

Next time, try harder kid.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:49 AM   #424
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I do kinda miss some of the insane crazyness you could only get with a half hour toy commercial. One episode would be Lion-O trying to save unicorns from cyborg vikings. Another would be Tygra and a Warrior maiden getting stuck invisible during a rescue mission. Half the cats taking the Thundertank undersea to help a walrus fight a giant robot. Mumm-Ra summons a samurai to mess Lion-O up. You just did not know what crazy thing was going to happen when you turned on the TV. Also the snazy theme.

It seems Tygra still hasn't gotten over his jelousy of Lion-O. Honestly though, Tygra really does not have anything to be jelous of. All bieng king has really given Lion-O is a ton of responsibilitys and problems. Other than those and a title, Tygra really has always gotten all the cream, while Lion-O has gotten all the trouble. Tygra needs to get over it fully, and support his brother, showing some actual charecter growth. Or at some point we will have to have Lion-O finally kick Tygra's ass.
Tygra missed ratar-o's little speech about lion-o being a king with out a kingdom
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:51 AM   #425
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Okay, this might sound kind of mean, but I'm not trying to push it that way.

Part of my point is I'm not sure where the line would be good enough for you. If he orders his LI around like a soldier (which she is likely to be, given the nature of the plot) 90% of the time, and is supportive and nice 10% of the time, is that okay?

My point is that the plot is what it is, a coming of age story about Lion-o, and his position is what it is, abolute monarch. Of course they should have scenes where he helps whoever his love interest is, but it's very likely these scenes would still be about Lion-o, rather than whoever his love interest is. In the end the balance will always swing his way, due to both the story that is being told, and 'reality.' How balanced is balanced enough for you?

Because of what this show is, I think you'd have to work very, very hard to depict anyone as equal to Lion-o.
So the show should be called Lion-o and the Thundercats or the adventures of Lion-o & snarf
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:51 AM   #426
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Actually Balgus, my name is Glenn Dawson.

So I'm not allowed to reply to posts on an open forum? Wow, you're as pathetic as Daniel Norton.

Next time, try harder kid.
I'd like to know where I said anyone wasn't allowed to reply to posts. And I'm not the one ranting and calling people pathetic.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:53 AM   #427
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I still chuckle at Snowman and Snow Meow, I mean... how intimidating was that? Snow MEOW? Really?
hey hey snow-meow was a beast
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:53 AM   #428
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It's not debatable. Tygra's gift allowed her to sit on those steps for days, is this not what she said at the end of 13? What does Jaga have to do with this?Who knows what Jaga would have done, not that it really matter as far as the flower goes.
Tygra's gift helped nourish her during her stint on the steps. We don't know what Jaga would have done, but we do know she was out there for a long time without any food or water.
Tygra giving her a flower is not what makes this Cheetara's defining moment. The audience get's to see that she will do anything to make her dreams of becoming a Cleric a reality.


She was already sitting on those steps for days. She says the flower helped her endure but she never says it was absolutley what guaranteed her becoming a cleric.

It was her choice to remain out there without food and water, not Jaga's and not Tygra's.

From what we have seen of Jaga, it is highly dubious to think he wouldn't have helped her.

According to Daniel Norton, Tygra giving her the flower IS the definging moment.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:54 AM   #429
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Almost certain.

Like Phillip, you'd be wrong.
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:00 AM   #430
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hey hey snow-meow was a beast
Literally
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:00 AM   #431
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That is just a plain lie. I copy/pasted what Dan said directly from the thread. Just because I didn't post his replies to "Nick"'s attacks doesn't mean He didn't say what I quoted.



No he said the audience was mislead.

A triangle is when two people like one person and you don't know who she'll chose between them. It does NOT mean she's in love with both people. That's just ridiculous.

And I also copy-n-pasted what Dan said as well as what Nick replied with.



A triangle requires a triangle. By DN saying there never really was a triangle, it defeats the entire argument of what a triangle is. I'm not surprised you can't grasp this simple concept.


Thanks for the laughs sport.
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:03 AM   #432
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well until he finds the sword/stones, destroying the planet would kinda be overkill, don't ya think? lol
If he destroys the planet maybe only the swords & stones would survive. Oppps I just gave mumm-ra the ultimate plan
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:06 AM   #433
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LMAO

He is certainly copying and pasting the same things the AnonymousIncognito who is "that Nick guy" posted in other boards. Unless he stole the nickname and is stealing the words too...

So what is it? Do we have an impersonator, or a schizophrenic?

Wow Eclipse, like Balgus, when you do insecure and syupid, you go all out.
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:07 AM   #434
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That is how I feel.

Thank you.
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:08 AM   #435
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And I also copy-n-pasted what Dan said as well as what Nick replied with.



A triangle requires a triangle. By DN saying there never really was a triangle, it defeats the entire argument of what a triangle is. I'm not surprised you can't grasp this simple concept.


Thanks for the laughs sport.
This is what you quoted Dan as saying:
"You're mislead to believe it's a relationship between two but the flashback reveals where the other relationship started. If you remember, Tygra was flirting with her during the sword ceremony from the first episode. Though we haven't shown it at this point, you don't know how many times they have stolen moments during their paths crossing before. But the most pivotal moment in Cheetarah's life was joining the Clerics. Tygra helped her achieve that. Lion-O is an assignment. She saw something special in him and she supported him, period."

Nowhere does he say there was no love triangle.

Nick was the one that said there was no love triangle.

Come on dude can't you keep your own posts straight?

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Old 05-10-2012, 10:10 AM   #436
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ummm, what don't you understand about personal preference? Come on man, I said as much in the post you quoted.

I simply provided a general reply to the entireity of your posts concerning the aspects of Lion-O as king.

Untwist your Tygraroo undies and relax a bit kid. You'll avoid a heart attack at age tweleve that way.
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:11 AM   #437
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So the show should be called Lion-o and the Thundercats or the adventures of Lion-o & snarf
IDK, the Lion-O & Snarf Mystery Hour sounds kinda fun.
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:13 AM   #438
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Originally Posted by Balgus82 View Post
I'd like to know where I said anyone wasn't allowed to reply to posts. And I'm not the one ranting and calling people pathetic.
Well you cry like a baby over me replying to posts so obviously you don't want me replying to posts.


Boo-hoo, I don't agree with you and i voiced that disagreement. Get over yourself.
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:14 AM   #439
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Originally Posted by AlexofThundera View Post
Literally


And a great one at that. I wonder if we will see Lion-O exerting control over cats?
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:15 AM   #440
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Originally Posted by Big Snarf View Post
If he destroys the planet maybe only the swords & stones would survive. Oppps I just gave mumm-ra the ultimate plan

If he destroys the Planet, maybe we see an Exodus to another planet like in the OS?
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:17 AM   #441
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Originally Posted by AnonymousIncognito View Post
That is debatable.

1. Jaga wanted her to learn patience. She failed the initial test due to her lack of it. Sitting on the steps to near death could be pointed out as enough reason to allow her in.

2. It could be argued that it is not within Jaga's nature to leave her to die on the steps thus he would have brought her in even without the flower.

3. Tygra didn't know anything about the properties so he had no way of knowing it would help or not.

4. Considering how easily replacable the characters are, it doesn't strike me as any kind of defining moment. Simply because it just as easily could have been Lion-o giving her the flower.

5. Sounds like you are trying to make brownie points with DN by parroting the poor excuses DN used on FB. Are you by chance that Phillip person I see also commenting on FB?
The flower could be the first nice thing anyone in thundera did for her (we see how kit and kat were treated) or the only thing someone other then her parents gave her that why she cherishes it. Lion-o was busy trying to build a ps3 to give cheetara the flower
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:18 AM   #442
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IDK, the Lion-O & Snarf Mystery Hour sounds kinda fun.
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:20 AM   #443
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Originally Posted by Big Snarf View Post
The flower could be the first nice thing anyone in thundera did for her (we see how kit and kat were treated) or the only thing someone other then her parents gave her that why she cherishes it. Lion-o was busy trying to build a ps3 to give cheetara the flower
Makes me wonder how young Lion-O was when he started getting interested in Technology and what started the fascination.
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:22 AM   #444
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Originally Posted by Balgus82 View Post
This is what you quoted Dan as saying:
"You're mislead to believe it's a relationship between two but the flashback reveals where the other relationship started. If you remember, Tygra was flirting with her during the sword ceremony from the first episode. Though we haven't shown it at this point, you don't know how many times they have stolen moments during their paths crossing before. But the most pivotal moment in Cheetarah's life was joining the Clerics. Tygra helped her achieve that. Lion-O is an assignment. She saw something special in him and she supported him, period."

Nowhere does he say there was no love triangle.

Nick was the one that said there was no love triangle.

Come on dude can't you keep your own posts straight?

Actually sport, what I take away from that IS Daniel saying there never was a triangle. And for the excat reason Nick pointed out. His analogy lacked a third party and it did not fit into the scheme of the cartoon as well.

I've kept things straighter than you. Then again, after reading your sheer amount of brown nosing, your childishness is easily understood.
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:24 AM   #445
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Lion-O liked Cheetara. Tygra liked Cheetara. We didn't know who Cheetara liked.

Love triangle.


is that really so complicated?
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:24 AM   #446
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Originally Posted by Balgus82 View Post
Makes me wonder how young Lion-O was when he started getting interested in Technology and what started the fascination.
Lion-O's the nerd of the group. He probably got into it quite young

And saying that made me realise just how well the cast of tcats fit into a highschool drama trope -_- I wonder if it's intentional
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:25 AM   #447
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The flower could be the first nice thing anyone in thundera did for her (we see how kit and kat were treated) or the only thing someone other then her parents gave her that why she cherishes it. Lion-o was busy trying to build a ps3 to give cheetara the flower

LMAO at the PS3 line!

You could be right but that all goes back to what many fans are taking issue with. The way the explanation was done was moronic and rushed. Cheetara never really got a backstory yet so everything about her past is in the dark. Thus we don't know what her reason or rhyme for wanting to be a cleric comes from. We don't know her situation prior to arriving in the kingdom.

All in all, it was just poorly done scenes and poorly done character development.
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:25 AM   #448
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Originally Posted by Balgus82 View Post
Lion-O liked Cheetara. Tygra liked Cheetara. We didn't know who Cheetara liked.

Love triangle.


is that really so complicated?
Eh, Betty-Archie-Veronica is a love triangle. Not that it's well done, but at least the requisite points are there. And it's not one that's easily resolved either
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:26 AM   #449
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Makes me wonder how young Lion-O was when he started getting interested in Technology and what started the fascination.

This is something we agree on.
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:26 AM   #450
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Originally Posted by Big Snarf View Post
The flower could be the first nice thing anyone in thundera did for her (we see how kit and kat were treated) or the only thing someone other then her parents gave her that why she cherishes it. Lion-o was busy trying to build a ps3 to give cheetara the flower
You're too funy But he probably was... besides at that age he probably thought girls were gross.
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