Thundercats Episode 21 Birth of the Blade Discussion

[CCDustyV]

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnonymousIncognito

I can see the episode now.

Tygra bends down and Cheetara flips out seeing him wearing one of her thongs. Pumyra checks her bag and finds she is missing underwear. Tygra is forced to admit he is a panty-sniffer.


Lol yeah. Good thing the Queen had a green thumb or Cheetara would have gone with the more noble Prince.

she was a slave girl... does she even have underwear under that dress?

[L08e16o]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CCDustyV

she was a slave girl... does she even have underwear under that dress?

And lion-o missed his shot.

[Tygrastripes]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CCDustyV

I do agree, I didn't ake it as being overly mean, but some of the comments ruffled my feathers just a tad, but I've taken worse hits. But I've mentioned many times my mistrust of Tygra on TCL and was chewed out repeatedly. I won't defend my writing, if anyone doesn't like my stories, that's fine, I'm not holding anyone at gunpoint to read it. if they like it, great! If not, that's cool too, I do respect creative criticism. If something I write you don't agree with, tell me so in a polite manner, but should I disagree with your statements, I will give you the reasonings behind my way of thinking and leave it at that. Nothing more and nothing less.

but if being refered to as "Another butthead Lion-O fanboy" is that's the best they can throw at me on ff.net, I laugh. I dunno if the anno flame was a TLC member, heck they could be a member on this forum. either way, I'm 85-90% certain that the two flames came from the same person. And should that person be on this forum and reading this I say the same thing that I do to anyone who just does not like my stories. I'm not selling the stories, and you're not paying to read um, so tough tofu. go read another fic that's more to your taste.

TC fics section on ff.net are growing with fics that support both pairings. you'll find something else ya'all like I'm sure if I'm not your cup of tea.

Hmm well as one of the posters who commented on fanfiction stories at TCL I feel I should probably apologize for any hurt feelings CCDustyV, though I doubt it was your story I was referring to when I spoke about character bashing, this author could barely spell and I couldn't really make sense of anything but rage, this fic being posted only a day after Between Brothers obviously had the writer working out a LOT of frustration (insane violence, gore, swearing and mutilation to one of the characters) and it doesn't look like you have any problems spelling or articulating so again I don't apologize for what I said I apologize just if anyone felt their fic was targeted/bashed and was hurt by it. If you don't mind me asking since I'm pretty sure it isn't your fic I was talking about, did you post your tale somewhere else behinds FF.net, i found the other fic on tumblr, what fic is it you feel posters were referring to? If you aren't comfortable sharing thats fine too, I only ask because now I'm curious to read it, I'll read pretty much anything that's well written, though I confess I'll read a Tygra/Cheetara fic before most other ones.

It's tough being a fic writer, I may not like something but i'd never leave anything for the author's review but offer constructive critism to the writer if I felt the need to.

[Tygrastripes]

Anywho moving right along, I can't wait to see Mummra actually be formidable with the SoP!

[CCDustyV]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tygrastripes

Hmm well as one of the posters who commented on fanfiction stories at TCL I feel I should probably apologize for any hurt feelings CCDustyV, though I doubt it was your story I was referring to when I spoke about character bashing, this author could barely spell and I couldn't really make sense of anything but rage, this fic being posted only a day after Between Brothers obviously had the writer working out a LOT of frustration (insane violence, gore, swearing and mutilation to one of the characters) and it doesn't look like you have any problems spelling or articulating so again I don't apologize for what I said I apologize just if anyone felt their fic was targeted/bashed and was hurt by it. If you don't mind me asking since I'm pretty sure it isn't your fic I was talking about, did you post your tale somewhere else behinds FF.net, i found the other fic on tumblr, what fic is it you feel posters were referring to? If you aren't comfortable sharing thats fine too, I only ask because now I'm curious to read it, I'll read pretty much anything that's well written, though I confess I'll read a Tygra/Cheetara fic before most other ones.

It's tough being a fic writer, I may not like something but i'd never leave anything for the author's review but offer constructive critism to the writer if I felt the need to.

I know the fic you're refering to and I admit it wasn't very well written and did seem like a knee jerk. Yours wasn't one of the ones who rubbed me wrong so don't worry about it do appreciate the unwarrented appology. I normally just post on ff.net, under my penname classic cowboy, tho I did post links here for my 2 TC fics. my ongoing fic (Blood and Sand) won't be nice to Tygra at first but I plan to focus a lot on building both him and Lion-O up as strong noble characters. the oneshot which caused a lil bit of a stir (Reality Check) just had Pumyra telling Cheetara about Tygra having a more jaded past than she realized and left it at that. If you're interested in checking them out you're more than welcome to them.

and to be honest flames don't even bother me that badly, do get annoyed when annon flames that don't leave any way for me to contact back. rather cowardly IMO. Those are what get me riled up.

[AnonymousIncognito]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CCDustyV

she was a slave girl... does she even have underwear under that dress?

LOL, she bought the panties during one of those many "off scene" moments that take place.

[AnonymousIncognito]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CCDustyV

I know the fic you're refering to and I admit it wasn't very well written and did seem like a knee jerk. Yours wasn't one of the ones who rubbed me wrong so don't worry about it do appreciate the unwarrented appology. I normally just post on ff.net, under my penname classic cowboy, tho I did post links here for my 2 TC fics. my ongoing fic (Blood and Sand) won't be nice to Tygra at first but I plan to focus a lot on building both him and Lion-O up as strong noble characters. the oneshot which caused a lil bit of a stir (Reality Check) just had Pumyra telling Cheetara about Tygra having a more jaded past than she realized and left it at that. If you're interested in checking them out you're more than welcome to them.

and to be honest flames don't even bother me that badly, do get annoyed when annon flames that don't leave any way for me to contact back. rather cowardly IMO. Those are what get me riled up.

It really is a great story. Big thanks to a certain Canadian for pointing me in its direction.

[stormbringer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CCDustyV

she was a slave girl... does she even have underwear under that dress?

The TCats were naked in the first episode of the OS,they may not worry about those kinds of things.

[AnonymousIncognito]

Quote:

Originally Posted by stormbringer

the tcats were naked in the first episode of the os,they may not worry about those kinds of things.:d

tongue bath!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[BB Shockwave]

The Galaxy/Solar System thing is very likely a miscommunication between the writers and the animation team (which is in Japan, I believe) - they probably asked for a solar system to be drawn, and somehow this got translated as a galaxy. Happens more often than you imagine in animation, and actually, happened a LOT in actual classic art! Have you seen paintings or statues depicting the biblical Moses with horns? There are quite a lot of those... and they all stem from the translation mistake which translated the aramic text of the Old Testament as "Moses came down from the hill with the tablets, and there was a light over his head" as "horns over his head."

[FreakinZoid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnonymousIncognito

We Americans also call the puma/cougar a Mountain LION.

Swing and a miss sport.

Americans aren't the only ones. Central and South Ameriica as well.Many countries and nations know the puma as the mountain lion.

[FreakinZoid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnonymousIncognito

I noticed that the slaves really didn't seem all that upset with Lion-O. The one he gave water to seem really grateful and when they were freed and told to go to the refuge, none of them mouthed off at Lion-O at all.

I kind of saw that as just overall poor writing quality on the staffs part - of which there seems to be a lot of at times.

In "The Pit" Pumyra made it seem like the Cat slaves were out for Lion-O's blood. Then, when we actually see the slaves react to Lion-O, no anger or resentment at all.
Does Pumyra have some special ability to take in anger akin to Heath Ledgers character in "The Order" taking in sin?

[FreakinZoid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlexofThundera

Not that the writers intended it like this, but the only excuse I can think of for the difference in Pumyras actions from last episode to this one is that she was enslaved for months in the mines, followed by having to fight in the Pit for the dogs amusement. Suddenly she is free and going through a wave of emotions, trying to re-acclimate to the "free" world. It's sort of like what a rescued POW goes through after months of enslavement and separation from the free world.

Very good point. If that is the case, I just wish the animators and writers did a better of showing it.

[FreakinZoid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnonymousIncognito

I can see the episode now.

Tygra bends down and Cheetara flips out seeing him wearing one of her thongs. Pumyra checks her bag and finds she is missing underwear. Tygra is forced to admit he is a panty-sniffer.


Lol yeah. Good thing the Queen had a green thumb or Cheetara would have gone with the more noble Prince.

That would be a funny filler episode.

[FreakinZoid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnonymousIncognito

tongue bath!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Laughed so much, I coughed up my coffee.

[Thunderian scholar]

Quote:

Originally Posted by L08e16o

Hey, don't give anyone ideas. We might see some art work with that in it.

Maybe he was tending to his flower collection.

Rule 34!! Rule 34!

[Kutoal]

I have a question, as Leo used the book of omens, but after Jaga written to and hide it, is the same book?
sorry for my bad English

[Big Snarf]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CCDustyV

she was a slave girl... does she even have underwear under that dress?

Yeah mumm-ra used her underwear to give her a wedgie and tie her to the rock .

[cosmOthunderKats2610]

And if anyone noticed it was will friedle who wrote that episode

[KaleRylan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cosmOthunderKats2610

And if anyone noticed it was will friedle who wrote that episode

Really? You mean this episode? Because it's really not that bad compared to the rest of the series. Sure it's got mistakes, but at least it was entertaining and not completely infuriating, which is more than can be said of a lot of the other episodes. Go him I guess.

[CCDustyV]

Quote:

Originally Posted by KaleRylan

Really? You mean this episode? Because it's really not that bad compared to the rest of the series. Sure it's got mistakes, but at least it was entertaining and not completely infuriating, which is more than can be said of a lot of the other episodes. Go him I guess.

I have noticed a trend, the show's best dialogue has come from Will's episodes. tallented, is he.

[Leppardra]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThundercatPanthro

Was that the Hammer of Thundera that the blacksmith made the SOP

I don't believe it was, as the blacksmith was not Bengali.

[Leppardra]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cosmOthunderKats2610

And if anyone noticed it was will friedle who wrote that episode

Yes, I did see that he wrote the episode, which makes it the second episode he's done so far.

I wonder if anybody noticed an animation glitch. Leo and Panthera are on the bridge of Mumm-Ra's ship and in one scene Panthera looked transparent.

[AnonymousIncognito]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leppardra

Yes, I did see that he wrote the episode, which makes it the second episode he's done so far.

I wonder if anybody noticed an animation glitch. Leo and Panthera are on the bridge of Mumm-Ra's ship and in one scene Panthera looked transparent.

Yes, a lot of people noticed it as well as other animation errors (such as Tygra losing his stripes and coloration during that flashback when he lays that stupid flower beside Cheetara) but we have learned that it is not wise to point out animation errors or even criticize the animation in general. WB's art director Dan Norton tends to flip his lid when people criticize things.

Here's an example from his DeviantArt account(Dingo107 being Dan Norton's handle):

"NewGuy13 May 8, 2012
Errr... Look, I have nothing against the 1980's Pumyra.... but this one..... She looks like a man. Sorry, but the eyebrows, hair design, and lack of rack..... you are not buying me.
Reply

~Dingo107 May 8, 2012 Professional
OH MAN! Sorry NewGuy. I really wanted to make sure I made Pumyra how YOU wanted her. I'll be sure to run all of my creative input by you next time before I draw any other female characters. Is there a specific cup size you would prefer? Should I be more generous in the backside? I'm dying to hear your input.
Reply

~NewGuy13 May 8, 2012
Look, pal, there is no need for snarky come-backs. As an artist you have to learn and deal with other peoples opinions. I never critized you or your drawing abilities, which I think is great, I just have an opinion on the final design. It's no need for hostilities.

Reply
~Dingo107 May 8, 2012 Professional
It's my page buddy, I'll get snarky all day long. You don't know me. You come to my page and poke your finger in my chest and don't think I can respond as I choose. I didn't come to your page and ask for your opinion. Especially one that came across very insulting. In my 20+ years of being a professional artist, I've learned how to "deal" with peoples opinions. And I'm telling you to keep in in your back pocket and sit on it.
Reply

~NewGuy13 May 8, 2012
Pal, I re-posted to end any hostilities before they happened. Now you are just acting like a jerk. I already said I liked all of your other work, this one I was not so crazy about, and as a fan I think I have the right to give my honest opinion and not kiss-a*s. Just relax.
Reply

~Dingo107 May 8, 2012 Professional
It's because you don't know me, I'll just tell you... I am an prick. And I get more prickly when an individual such as yourself expresses themselves in a disrespectful manner with a crass comment. You then tell me I need to learn to deal with people giving me their opinions. Allow me to offer a lesson for you, when expressing your opinion about other peoples work, don't come across as misogynistic and glib. Especially when that opinion is insulting and uninvited. If you must, be constructive and respectful. Or you may just have to deal with another jerk like me. Drops the mic...... Picks it back up... And don't fu*king tell me to relax. Drops mic again...
Reply

~NewGuy13 May 8, 2012
Look, I didn't mean to be rude or insulting, but this has to end because it's getting on the verge of being really funny.
Reply

~Dingo107 May 8, 2012 Professional
Verge of being really funny.... It's hilarious. I've been making fun of you with my buddies since you sent this stupid fucking post in the first place. Fact is, it's too late you've pissed me off. And since you want to seem to control the conversation you started, I'll allow it. After you apologize with sincerity and not attaching some stipulation of being irrational. Make me pick up the mic again..... pffff."


This isn't the only time Dan Norton has gone off the deep-end. He's done it numerous times before. What is interesting though is, once his attacks and insults starting circulating amongst fans, he suddenly rushed to "hide" and "remove" the exchanges. Too bad people screencapped em prior to his scramble.

[fuukonomiko]

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnonymousIncognito

Yes, a lot of people noticed it as well as other animation errors (such as Tygra losing his stripes and coloration during that flashback when he lays that stupid flower beside Cheetara) but we have learned that it is not wise to point out animation errors or even criticize the animation in general. WB's art director Dan Norton tends to flip his lid when people criticize things.

Here's an example from his DeviantArt account(Dingo107 being Dan Norton's handle):

"NewGuy13 May 8, 2012
Errr... Look, I have nothing against the 1980's Pumyra.... but this one..... She looks like a man. Sorry, but the eyebrows, hair design, and lack of rack..... you are not buying me.
Reply

~Dingo107 May 8, 2012 Professional
OH MAN! Sorry NewGuy. I really wanted to make sure I made Pumyra how YOU wanted her. I'll be sure to run all of my creative input by you next time before I draw any other female characters. Is there a specific cup size you would prefer? Should I be more generous in the backside? I'm dying to hear your input.
Reply

~NewGuy13 May 8, 2012
Look, pal, there is no need for snarky come-backs. As an artist you have to learn and deal with other peoples opinions. I never critized you or your drawing abilities, which I think is great, I just have an opinion on the final design. It's no need for hostilities.

Reply
~Dingo107 May 8, 2012 Professional
It's my page buddy, I'll get snarky all day long. You don't know me. You come to my page and poke your finger in my chest and don't think I can respond as I choose. I didn't come to your page and ask for your opinion. Especially one that came across very insulting. In my 20+ years of being a professional artist, I've learned how to "deal" with peoples opinions. And I'm telling you to keep in in your back pocket and sit on it.
Reply

~NewGuy13 May 8, 2012
Pal, I re-posted to end any hostilities before they happened. Now you are just acting like a jerk. I already said I liked all of your other work, this one I was not so crazy about, and as a fan I think I have the right to give my honest opinion and not kiss-a*s. Just relax.
Reply

~Dingo107 May 8, 2012 Professional
It's because you don't know me, I'll just tell you... I am an prick. And I get more prickly when an individual such as yourself expresses themselves in a disrespectful manner with a crass comment. You then tell me I need to learn to deal with people giving me their opinions. Allow me to offer a lesson for you, when expressing your opinion about other peoples work, don't come across as misogynistic and glib. Especially when that opinion is insulting and uninvited. If you must, be constructive and respectful. Or you may just have to deal with another jerk like me. Drops the mic...... Picks it back up... And don't fu*king tell me to relax. Drops mic again...
Reply

~NewGuy13 May 8, 2012
Look, I didn't mean to be rude or insulting, but this has to end because it's getting on the verge of being really funny.
Reply

~Dingo107 May 8, 2012 Professional
Verge of being really funny.... It's hilarious. I've been making fun of you with my buddies since you sent this stupid fucking post in the first place. Fact is, it's too late you've pissed me off. And since you want to seem to control the conversation you started, I'll allow it. After you apologize with sincerity and not attaching some stipulation of being irrational. Make me pick up the mic again..... pffff."


This isn't the only time Dan Norton has gone off the deep-end. He's done it numerous times before. What is interesting though is, once his attacks and insults starting circulating amongst fans, he suddenly rushed to "hide" and "remove" the exchanges. Too bad people screencapped em prior to his scramble.

NewGuy13 is actually a very good friend of mine. He didn't want to push the matter any further.

[Chique]

The guy complained that Pumyra was a fail because her boobs were too small....

...She looks like a man because of her boob size.

This is who the fandom should defend

I don't think Dan did anything wrong. If someone wants to leave a rude comment, then they should expect a rude reply. Isn't that one of those golden rules? Fans have a habit of acting like they are entitled to a show that fits them perfectly, and when they decide to be an ass about it, they expect nothing short of sweet understanding from the creators.

LOL, then the guy spams Pumya fanart leaving no constructive criticism, only that she looks like a man. Like Dan said, if you want to leave a comment, then do so in a respectful manner. Not just for the sake of Dan, but also for the tons of people who visit his account daily.

Quote:

Allow me to offer a lesson for you, when expressing your opinion about other peoples work, don't come across as misogynistic and glib. Especially when that opinion is insulting and uninvited. If you must, be constructive and respectful. Or you may just have to deal with another jerk like me. Drops the mic...... Picks it back up... And don't fu*king tell me to relax. Drops mic again...

Yes. This part made me smile.

Welp, considering people are posting this little exchange all over the place, it's probably going to be kinda hard to just drop.

[snarkybits]

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnonymousIncognito

~NewGuy13 May 8, 2012
Look, pal, there is no need for snarky come-backs.
Reply
~Dingo107 May 8, 2012 Professional
It's my page buddy, I'll get snarky all day long.

Nice...

Anyway, this Dan Norton guy annoys me.

[Balgus82]

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnonymousIncognito

Yes, a lot of people noticed it as well as other animation errors (such as Tygra losing his stripes and coloration during that flashback when he lays that stupid flower beside Cheetara) but we have learned that it is not wise to point out animation errors or even criticize the animation in general. WB's art director Dan Norton tends to flip his lid when people criticize things.

Here's an example from his DeviantArt account(Dingo107 being Dan Norton's handle):

"NewGuy13 May 8, 2012
Errr... Look, I have nothing against the 1980's Pumyra.... but this one..... She looks like a man. Sorry, but the eyebrows, hair design, and lack of rack..... you are not buying me.
Reply

~Dingo107 May 8, 2012 Professional
OH MAN! Sorry NewGuy. I really wanted to make sure I made Pumyra how YOU wanted her. I'll be sure to run all of my creative input by you next time before I draw any other female characters. Is there a specific cup size you would prefer? Should I be more generous in the backside? I'm dying to hear your input.
Reply

~NewGuy13 May 8, 2012
Look, pal, there is no need for snarky come-backs. As an artist you have to learn and deal with other peoples opinions. I never critized you or your drawing abilities, which I think is great, I just have an opinion on the final design. It's no need for hostilities.

Reply
~Dingo107 May 8, 2012 Professional
It's my page buddy, I'll get snarky all day long. You don't know me. You come to my page and poke your finger in my chest and don't think I can respond as I choose. I didn't come to your page and ask for your opinion. Especially one that came across very insulting. In my 20+ years of being a professional artist, I've learned how to "deal" with peoples opinions. And I'm telling you to keep in in your back pocket and sit on it.
Reply

~NewGuy13 May 8, 2012
Pal, I re-posted to end any hostilities before they happened. Now you are just acting like a jerk. I already said I liked all of your other work, this one I was not so crazy about, and as a fan I think I have the right to give my honest opinion and not kiss-a*s. Just relax.
Reply

~Dingo107 May 8, 2012 Professional
It's because you don't know me, I'll just tell you... I am an prick. And I get more prickly when an individual such as yourself expresses themselves in a disrespectful manner with a crass comment. You then tell me I need to learn to deal with people giving me their opinions. Allow me to offer a lesson for you, when expressing your opinion about other peoples work, don't come across as misogynistic and glib. Especially when that opinion is insulting and uninvited. If you must, be constructive and respectful. Or you may just have to deal with another jerk like me. Drops the mic...... Picks it back up... And don't fu*king tell me to relax. Drops mic again...
Reply

~NewGuy13 May 8, 2012
Look, I didn't mean to be rude or insulting, but this has to end because it's getting on the verge of being really funny.
Reply

~Dingo107 May 8, 2012 Professional
Verge of being really funny.... It's hilarious. I've been making fun of you with my buddies since you sent this stupid fucking post in the first place. Fact is, it's too late you've pissed me off. And since you want to seem to control the conversation you started, I'll allow it. After you apologize with sincerity and not attaching some stipulation of being irrational. Make me pick up the mic again..... pffff."


This isn't the only time Dan Norton has gone off the deep-end. He's done it numerous times before. What is interesting though is, once his attacks and insults starting circulating amongst fans, he suddenly rushed to "hide" and "remove" the exchanges. Too bad people screencapped em prior to his scramble.

And what the heck did that have to do with the current conversation? Seems to me like you just have a grudge dude.

[monothingie]

I think Dan has a clear anti-boob agenda.

It's his fishbowl, don't like it? Don't swim in it and move on. But bear in mind that that is double-edged sword too.

[FreakinZoid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by fuukonomiko

NewGuy13 is actually a very good friend of mine. He didn't want to push the matter any further.

Just me but it looks more like they were just making a point about and not trying to push anything. I could be wrong though but that's just what I saw.

And honestly, from what I read, Dan Norton should have posted a public apology to NewGuy before he pulled the comments because what he said was WAY out of line.
If it's true that he's reacted like this before to criticism......

IDK, I'll leave it at that.

[FreakinZoid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chique

The guy complained that Pumyra was a fail because her boobs were too small....

...She looks like a man because of her boob size.

This is who the fandom should defend

I don't think Dan did anything wrong. If someone wants to leave a rude comment, then they should expect a rude reply. Isn't that one of those golden rules? Fans have a habit of acting like they are entitled to a show that fits them perfectly, and when they decide to be an ass about it, they expect nothing short of sweet understanding from the creators.

LOL, then the guy spams Pumya fanart leaving no constructive criticism, only that she looks like a man. Like Dan said, if you want to leave a comment, then do so in a respectful manner. Not just for the sake of Dan, but also for the tons of people who visit his account daily.


Yes. This part made me smile.

Welp, considering people are posting this little exchange all over the place, it's probably going to be kinda hard to just drop.

I guess we're going to have to disagree on what constitutes a rude comment because all i saw was a guy giving honest criticism. It's not like he said Dan couldn't draw or anything like that. He even said he liked his other works, just not that one. The replies from Dan were out of line in my opinion.

He could have just said "thanks for the input but I like the design the way it is" and be done with it. He didn't need to go off on the guy the way he did. If he showed some maturity, maybe the other guy would have as well. We'll never know...

[FreakinZoid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balgus82

And what the heck did that have to do with the current conversation? Seems to me like you just have a grudge dude.

I think it had something to do with someone spotting an animation error and someone else pointing out that apparently, Dan Norton does not handle criticism very well. If that comment is how he replies, I'm inclined to say Daniel needs to get some anger management sessions in and fast.

[Balgus82]

Quote:

Originally Posted by FreakinZoid

I think it had something to do with someone spotting an animation error and someone else pointing out that apparently, Dan Norton does not handle criticism very well. If that comment is how he replies, I'm inclined to say Daniel needs to get some anger management sessions in and fast.

Dan Norton doesn't do the animation, nor does he direct the episodes. Any animation errors would not be his fault. So bringing him up is off-topic.

And it's not just that post. There are multiple posts where AnonymousIncognito brings up Dan, making snide comments about him, when no one else is talking about Dan at all.

Also I think Dan had every right to defend himself. Telling someone a woman he draws looks like a man cause her boobs aren't big enough is not constructive criticism.

[Balgus82]

Also he explained why he deleted those posts. Fans were coming to defend him and were subsequently being attacked by trolls because of it.

"Thanks to the peeps who in the last few days have gratuitously put out their necks to defend my opinions on my posts. I give you a salute and offer my apologies for the personal attacks that came with that noble gesture. I've blocked the offenders and removed posts that seemed to have triggered a fallout upon people whom I respect and admire that came to my defense. I hope that keeps folks on the up and up. Out of this respect, I'll try to avoid answering posts I find vapid, shallow and flat out stupid so nobody else will incur the wrath. But I'm an artist, it's bound to happen again .

D "

[Thunderian scholar]

Instated Wheaton's Law on the internet: "Don't be a dick!"

[CCDustyV]

anyway you want to paint a jerk, he's still a jerk. As an artist he is incredibly tallented, but not a fan of him as a person, which takes away from my appreciation and respect.

[AnonymousIncognito]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balgus82

Dan Norton doesn't do the animation, nor does he direct the episodes. Any animation errors would not be his fault. So bringing him up is off-topic.

And it's not just that post. There are multiple posts where AnonymousIncognito brings up Dan, making snide comments about him, when no one else is talking about Dan at all.

Also I think Dan had every right to defend himself. Telling someone a woman he draws looks like a man cause her boobs aren't big enough is not constructive criticism.

Sorry if my "snide remarks" upset you. As the old saying goes, you can please some of the people some of the time but you can't please all of the people all of the time.

And seeing as this is a place to discuss Thundercats and Dan works on Thundercats......

Let's just agree to disagree shall we?

[FreakinZoid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balgus82

Dan Norton doesn't do the animation, nor does he direct the episodes. Any animation errors would not be his fault. So bringing him up is off-topic.

And it's not just that post. There are multiple posts where AnonymousIncognito brings up Dan, making snide comments about him, when no one else is talking about Dan at all.

Also I think Dan had every right to defend himself. Telling someone a woman he draws looks like a man cause her boobs aren't big enough is not constructive criticism.

I don't recall saying he did. I just answered your question as best I could.

Sorry but people make snide remarks about others all the time - just watch MSNBC, FOX News, or listen to talk news radio like NPR or the like - so I can't really side with you on that. Human nature is human nature.

I would agree with you if the comment had been just about the boobs but it wasn't. The hair and eyebrows were also mentioned so to me, it was an all around honest criticism. Add to the fact the guy said he liked Dan's other work, just not that one so I still have to stand by what I said; Dan was out of line.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balgus82

Also he explained why he deleted those posts. Fans were coming to defend him and were subsequently being attacked by trolls because of it.

"Thanks to the peeps who in the last few days have gratuitously put out their necks to defend my opinions on my posts. I give you a salute and offer my apologies for the personal attacks that came with that noble gesture. I've blocked the offenders and removed posts that seemed to have triggered a fallout upon people whom I respect and admire that came to my defense. I hope that keeps folks on the up and up. Out of this respect, I'll try to avoid answering posts I find vapid, shallow and flat out stupid so nobody else will incur the wrath. But I'm an artist, it's bound to happen again .

D "

I feel that if he never reacted in such a tactless manner to begin with and handled criticism better, the fans wouldn't have needed to come to his rescue so to speak. Then again, I didn't really read much of any opinion in Daniels replies to the individual, just a whole lot of anger and rage over nothing that deserved such anger and rage.

I understand that you will continue to defend Daniel and that's okay. I don't want you to feel like you need to go on any kind of defensive or anything with me over this.
I just can't defend a person who says that kind of stuff to another who just gave their honest opinion and didn't appear to be trolling at all. That's just me.

[FreakinZoid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnonymousIncognito

Sorry if my "snide remarks" upset you. As the old saying goes, you can please some of the people some of the time but you can't please all of the people all of the time.

And seeing as this is a place to discuss Thundercats and Dan works on Thundercats......

Let's just agree to disagree shall we?

Sometimes agreeing to disagree is the best thing to do.

Just remember that certain people can be sensative about certain things. I'm not telling you to walk on eggshells, just try to keep in mind that in todays society, there are those who are easily offended by the most trivial of things.

In the interest of overall peace and waffles, try not to hold it against them.

[Balgus82]

Quote:

Originally Posted by FreakinZoid

I understand that you will continue to defend Daniel and that's okay. I don't want you to feel like you need to go on any kind of defensive or anything with me over this.
I just can't defend a person who says that kind of stuff to another who just gave their honest opinion and didn't appear to be trolling at all. That's just me.

I don't think that particular guy was trolling, but I do believe his comments were out of line. Maybe Dan shouldn't have been quite as harsh, but it's his page and frankly how the dude worded his initial comment would've insulted me as well. It wasn't written constructively. He didn't start saying he liked Dan's other work until after the first reply by Dan.

However when people defended him others definitely did troll (hence Dan deleting the posts). For example there was a dude who would reply to the commenters, trash their artwork (when they're obviously amateurs), and say they could draw better (when they had absolutely no artwork on their DA page). THAT was trolling.

[AnonymousIncognito]

Quote:

Originally Posted by FreakinZoid

I understand that you will continue to defend Daniel and that's okay. I don't want you to feel like you need to go on any kind of defensive or anything with me over this.
I just can't defend a person who says that kind of stuff to another who just gave their honest opinion and didn't appear to be trolling at all. That's just me.

Freak, the one thing you'll learn is that "certain people" will bend over backwards to dryhump Norton no matter what he does or says. He could announce that he is killing 1,000 babies by way of sodomy and "certain people" will go to their grave defending him for doing it. Brainy Smurf Sycophants are odd like that.

[BB Shockwave]

AnonymousIncognito, why is there no Dislike button next to posts? 'Cause I'd really, really like to dislike yours. It's like anything that you post is bile, putrid hatred.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnonymousIncognito

Yes, a lot of people noticed it as well as other animation errors (such as Tygra losing his stripes and coloration during that flashback when he lays that stupid flower beside Cheetara) but we have learned that it is not wise to point out animation errors or even criticize the animation in general. WB's art director Dan Norton tends to flip his lid when people criticize things.

Here's an example from his DeviantArt account(Dingo107 being Dan Norton's handle):

I can totally understand him. The guy produces exterme quality art (seriously, his work is astounding) and when he does post the designs online all he gets is some butt-hurt nerds whining about how Pumyra has too big eyebrows or other similar nonesense.

Let me tell you, when Derrick Wyatt shared his Animated TF designs, most of the Transformers fans posting on his blog were GLAD and THANKFUL he shared them, and did not criticise his art style. An art director does not have to share his designs with the fans, in many series, it is actually forbidden to do so by the company making the cartoon. In most franchises I know, the fans are thankful for this. Apparently, in Thundercats fandom, people rather whine about minute details. Seriously, you lot are pissed off about really small things. I would like to see your faces if you had to deal with major "turn the story upside down, redesign everything until it's unrecognizable" changes like we Transformers fans had to deal with. I'd like to see the reactions if tomorrow you would learn Michael Bay was directing a live-action Thundercats movie with Shia LeBeuf as Lion-O.

[FreakinZoid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnonymousIncognito

Freak, the one thing you'll learn is that "certain people" will bend over backwards to dryhump Norton no matter what he does or says. He could announce that he is killing 1,000 babies by way of sodomy and "certain people" will go to their grave defending him for doing it. Brainy Smurf Sycophants are odd like that.

In a way, your remark mirrors Mr. Norton's replies; overly harsh in expressing your respective "opinions."
While I wouldn't phrase it as hashly as you did, I have noticed that there are those in many different fandoms who refuse to see fault in those they place on pedestals. Again, that's human nature. Look at how many people still insist OJ is innocent.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BB Shockwave

AnonymousIncognito, why is there no Dislike button next to posts? 'Cause I'd really, really like to dislike yours. It's like anything that you post is bile, putrid hatred.



I can totally understand him. The guy produces exterme quality art (seriously, his work is astounding) and when he does post the designs online all he gets is some butt-hurt nerds whining about how Pumyra has too big eyebrows or other similar nonesense.

Let me tell you, when Derrick Wyatt shared his Animated TF designs, most of the Transformers fans posting on his blog were GLAD and THANKFUL he shared them, and did not criticise his art style. An art director does not have to share his designs with the fans, in many series, it is actually forbidden to do so by the company making the cartoon. In most franchises I know, the fans are thankful for this. Apparently, in Thundercats fandom, people rather whine about minute details. Seriously, you lot are pissed off about really small things. I would like to see your faces if you had to deal with major "turn the story upside down, redesign everything until it's unrecognizable" changes like we Transformers fans had to deal with. I'd like to see the reactions if tomorrow you would learn Michael Bay was directing a live-action Thundercats movie with Shia LeBeuf as Lion-O.

Because if there was a dislike button, more than just his posts would be clicked on. Everyone on here has posted comments that would end up cathing at least one or two dislikes. Not everyone will agree with everyone else. Again, human nature. Bush v Gore.....

Same thing applies to the art he produces; not everyone will like everything he does. People have different tases. We even have a Constitutional Amendment in the United States that protects peoples right to express those tastes through various forms of speech. When Mr. norton puts his work out for public display, he should do so and willing to accept the critical views of all the public; even those who don't like the work. Note that criticism is often defined as pointing out a problem. The approach to pointing out the problem varies depending on the choice of criticism used. (logical, practical, theoretical, scholarly, and so on) There are critics in fashion, art, film and such whose good word can make a person and whos negative word can break a person. Life shows that not all criticism will be "nice."
So if Mr. Norton intimates to be able to accept criticism, in my opinion, he sure has a rather harsh and off kilter way of showing that acceptance.

Fans all react and express themselves differently. I've been to some conventions where fights broke out amongst Trekkies and Jedi and even Trekkies and Trekkies (Kirk v Piccard). There are fans of all genres that tend to micro-examine minute details. Shows like The Simpsons often make it a point to poke fun at that truth. Simply lumping it all on certain TC fans is really unfair of you.
As for: "we Transformers fans had to deal with" based on the fact there were three films and they all grossed fairly well, it seems not all Transformers fans were as upset as you make it sound. Again, kind of unfair of you to try and do a lumping of fans.

As to my reaction to a TC/Mike Bay live action? I'd use one of the many freebie coupons I have for the local theater to check it out because I am always in the mood for a good comedy.
From your comment, I took away that you weren't happy how Transformers turned out. Try to use your experience in that regard to see things from the perspective of those fans who might not be happy with the way TC is turning out. Try to empathize with them. That's what I try to do.


And what is it with this "butt-hurt" term I see being tossed around so much. Some jerk on fanfiction flamed a really good story without signing in (the sign of a bottom-feeding coward as far as I'm concerned) using that term and others were using it on some TC blog a friend of mine made me read. Now I see it turning up here. Not saying you are the one using it on these other sites, just that I find it curious it has circulated so much.

[Balgus82]

butthurt is a very common term on the internet btw.


Anyway it's not that Dan can't take criticism. It's how that criticism is presented that's the problem. Frankly if he couldn't take criticism there would be no way he would be able to make a living doing what he does because his bosses (and potential bosses) can and would criticize the hell out of his work.

[FreakinZoid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balgus82

butthurt is a very common term on the internet btw.


Anyway it's not that Dan can't take criticism. It's how that criticism is presented that's the problem. Frankly if he couldn't take criticism there would be no way he would be able to make a living doing what he does because his bosses (and potential bosses) can and would criticize the hell out of his work.

Honestly, I haven't really seen the term used that much outside of this fandom so that's why I was curious.


I think it is more how the criticism is percieved, not presented. Anyone can percieve even well presented criticism as negative.

I find there to a big difference between taking on the job criticism and off the clock criticism. On the job, one often has to temper ones self to keep the job. Off the clock is a different story. One can react as Mr. Norton did with little fear work related consequence.
In my opinion, it seems Mr. Norton does have some serious anger management and criticism acceptance issues. Not that that takes away from his talent as a cartoonist but to me it does take a lot away from his personal character. Still, just because I don't care much for him, it won't take away form me enjoying the overall show.

Again, that's just my opinion. I know we won't agree and that's cool. As long as the peace and waffles are maintained, all will be well.

[Chique]

Quote:

Originally Posted by FreakinZoid

Honestly, I haven't really seen the term used that much outside of this fandom so that's why I was curious.


I think it is more how the criticism is percieved, not presented. Anyone can percieve even well presented criticism as negative.

I find there to a big difference between taking on the job criticism and off the clock criticism. On the job, one often has to temper ones self to keep the job. Off the clock is a different story. One can react as Mr. Norton did with little fear work related consequence.
In my opinion, it seems Mr. Norton does have some serious anger management and criticism acceptance issues. Not that that takes away from his talent as a cartoonist but to me it does take a lot away from his personal character. Still, just because I don't care much for him, it won't take away form me enjoying the overall show.

Again, that's just my opinion. I know we won't agree and that's cool. As long as the peace and waffles are maintained, all will be well.

Doesn't the perception of the criticism way heavily on how it's presented?
If NewGuy had presented his criticism in a more tactful way, Dan probably wouldnt have responded the way he did. Hey, you get what you give.

Sure some people can get constructive criticism and still fly off the handle, but NewGuy's comment was not constructive. He doesn't like the new design, and the way he decided to go about it was offensive.

[Singe]

Like I expected, Pumyra isn't going to roll over for Lion-O. She'll hold his chestnuts to the open fire when needed.

[FreakinZoid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chique

Doesn't the perception of the criticism way heavily on how it's presented?
If NewGuy had presented his criticism in a more tactful way, Dan probably wouldnt have responded the way he did. Hey, you get what you give.

Sure some people can get constructive criticism and still fly off the handle, but NewGuy's comment was not constructive. He doesn't like the new design, and the way he decided to go about it was offensive.

Just to clarify so I make sure I undertand you; do you mean way or weigh?
If it is weigh, my answer would be no, I do not.
Simply due to the fact that, as I pointed out earlier, even constructive criticism can be percieved as negative.

And remember, criticism does not have to be constructive. There is no law or rule or mandate that deems all criticism must be constructive. If there was; we wouldn't have over twenty noted forms and varities of criticism. Nor would art critics and such carry such a reputation.

We're going to have to agree to disagree on the nature of the criticism left by NewGuy. Personally, I didn't find it offensive at all. Chalk it up to further proof opinions vary from person to person.

[FreakinZoid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Singe

Like I expected, Pumyra isn't going to roll over for Lion-O. She'll hold his chestnuts to the open fire when needed.

Hairballs would have been a better euphamism.

[Chique]

Quote:

Originally Posted by FreakinZoid

Just to clarify so I make sure I undertand you; do you mean way or weigh?
If it is weigh, my answer would be no, I do not.
Simply due to the fact that, as I pointed out earlier, even constructive criticism can be percieved as negative.

And remember, criticism does not have to be constructive. There is no law or rule or mandate that deems all criticism must be constructive. If there was; we wouldn't have over twenty noted forms and varities of criticism. Nor would art critics and such carry such a reputation.

We're going to have to agree to disagree on the nature of the criticism left by NewGuy. Personally, I didn't find it offensive at all. Chalk it up to further proof opinions vary from person to person.

weigh heavily. Sorry, I don't ever bother proof reading these things. Thank God for context, right?
If someone presents their opinion in a negative way, then the probability of getting a negative response has been raised.
Personally, criticizing the size of a woman's breast, and then deeming that woman manly is offensive . Way more offensive than Dan getting hotty about it. Most female characters in cartoons have one body type. Just one. Men on the other hand are short, heavy set, lanky and buff. Though Pumyra is far from flat chested, it's offensive that any body type other than Cheetara's is deemed less feminine, or not as womanly. Just like men, women come in all shapes and sizes. That goes double for breast!
Criticizing her "lack of rack" is just gross and mean spirited.
Hope that post wasnt too difficult to read. Didn't proof read this one either
Ok. Agree to disagree.