there are some interesting stories we could get from lion-o out on his own.
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The main thing I agreed about his post is Lion O breaking off from the team for awhile. In the original series he often times went on Journeys by himself. The Thundercats for the most part is the back up. His character needs to standout more than what it has. More than that his strength needs to Standout from the rest.
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a storyline about lion-o going to explore third earth on his own has a lot of potential . he could become more mature as an individual and encounter new allies perhaps even pumyra and Ben-gali. I could see a story with mumm-ra capturing the other thundercats and holding them hostage in exchange for the sword , and a more badass lion-o along with Ben-gali and pumyra coming to the rescue.
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Thunderclaw,
You have made some valid points, but this is WHY Lion-O does NOT need to go out on his own. First of all, he is not supposed to be the hero...he's supposed to be the LORD of the Thundercats and how can he do that being alone? While he would learn how to depend on himself as well as learn to make better decisions, where will the trust between his people and their leader take place? In history, conquerors that have take power have had to learn to gain the trust and admiration of the people they are ruling to be a great leader. Anyone can be a exceptional warrior, but can't work in a team environment. The idea here is for him to be able to lead the others, to be able to gather others under him to finally defeat Mumm-ra...without the belief from his followers how can that be? Being on his own would strengthen him as a solitary person, not build a great leader and this is what is needed here. In the original, Lion-O was constantly being taught, because of his true age and the fact that he was never truly shown how to lead. There was an episode that he went on his own...for the purpose to sharpen his senses and to trust in his own decisions. I believe that this will more than likely happen in future shows. As far as this "triangle", I have to say that there is DEFINITELY a betrayal here. If Lion-O has believed up until this time that Cheetara had feelings for him, watching his brother kissing her AFTER learning that when they were younger he almost tried to kill him for being the "chosen one", there is NO WAY he would see it as anything else. I believe that this will serve as the catalyst for his up coming trials to finally earn the title of Lord of the Thundercats in more than just name. Now, he will feel he has to more than prove himself...even as a small attempt to change Cheetara's mind. Tygra, both, did him a service and a disservice. He has hurt him deeply, taking the one thing that was given to him without the fact that he was the next leader of the cats...Cheetara's affections. By doing that, he may have strengthed him in his quest to be the man his father always thought he would be, give him the belief in himself to lead without question. In that, he would have pushed Lion-O to be even better than himself. Being hurt this way will detrimental for a while...the trust and affection he had for them had been tarnished and it will take a LONG time for them to gain it back. Whethewr you like it or not, most rulers come by way of lineage and Lion-O in NOT the exception. Yes, we would LOVE to see him eran it, but it IS his by rights...regardless of anything else Tygra or anyone else may think. Lion-o was never shown to have a realtionship...it has been hinted at in the comics, but never really established. Maybe this anime will change that... |
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while I think it would be cool for lion-o to explore on his own for a while I don't see it happening. Lion-o is lord of the thundercats now and as such has a responsibility to his subjects. one of the problems lion-o.always had to deal with while in thundera was that most of the citizens thought he was unworthy to be their future king . lion-o is now faced with the choice to prove to himself and all others that he IS worthy, when no one else would have considered helping lizard prisoners, lion-o did and he was proven he made the right call when the same lizard he helped left he and tygra a key to their cell so they could escape . I believe the reason that lion-o can use sight beyond sight is because like Leo he can see other species as equals , making "sight beyond sight" not just literal but also a metaphor. only he can master the sword of omens, unite the other species , and lead them to defeat mummra .
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When the series began, most people mentioned that, Cheetara is not like Arcee (of Transformers: Prime) and not held back on emotions. Guess the roles have changed now, eh? ;) |
the thought of mummra kissing anyone is a truly disturbing thought.
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Didn't Mumm-ra do something similar in the OS? And i've heard people say the writers wouldn't do that cause this is made in America and by men. I highly doubt any of the writers are homophobes. And CN has gotten away with a lot more contriversal things, even in the 80's and 90's. Ren and Stimpy anyone?
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I am now greatly humored by the IDEa of Mumm-Ra kissing Tygra. >:} its too funny.
I too would loose a lot of respect of cheetara. Transformers reference, nice! |
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yeah mumm-ra used to shapeshift all the time in the 80's show ,so mumm-ra could impersonate cheetara. poor tygra if that happened he would probably want to downing tons of catnip to get that image out of his mind
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I wonder how Cheetara and the others would react? I bet Lion-o would be just as freaked out.
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if mumm-ra wanted to unbalance the thundercats there's no better way to do it.
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Haha yeah, but I don't think it would be a way to get Tygra, poor cat would be scared. Not only did he think he got the girl, but to also find out it was a mummy. Yuck! He will need more then catnip. Maybe whatever the elephants are on?
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well if ever there was a time for the sword to warn lion-o of danger that would be the time.
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The protagonist(Lion-O) getting beaten in a 1vs.1 against his douchebag brother, then begging him for his life and then additionally loosing his love interest to him.....
Needless to say this is the first thundercats episode that i Hated. I mean Cheetara even kissed Lion-O on the cheak in the previous episode before he went into the astral plane. ...Very disapointed. |
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1. See your own quote, for the second time. Quote:
Then there is you, who seem to be determined only to look at the latest episode, at one particular 10 second flashback without any credit or mention of anything else regarding the character, what we know of him, or other events that have happened. You are the definition of Selective Reasoning. Let me help you out as I don't think you have a full grasp on this concept. (The more scientifically correct term would be Confirmation Bias, but we will go with yours for sake of arguement) Selective reasoning, or pseudoscience, relies on the use of particular facts, beliefs, and unconfirmed opinions to foster a false understanding of events and things. - Taken as a direct quote from The Decline of Reason? by Jerre H. Lipps. Which is available online as an article from The Fossil Record, at the University of California Museum of Paleontology. I'd really like to put emphasis on this. It is exactly what you are doing, and exactly what I described you as doing in my first post to you. Want proof? Here is just one example. You clearly state... Quote:
I hate to have to even touch on the fact that Tygra did not kick him down into a pit, he kicked a log that broke and so he fell. He did leave, but to get help which cannot be denied....considering that Lion-O is still here present day and not at the bottom of a well. If you are trying to refer to present day, at no point did I see Tygra leave Lion-O in the well. He turned his back and stepped away after an adrenaline filled fight with his brother that Lion-O is just as much involved in. Not to mention, the both of them concluded and reasoned that this Spirit Realm was having an adverse affect on them, meaning it was amplifying their agressive tendencies. Someone behind the scenes controlling what was happening and they both overcame this manipulation, with Tygra jumping into the hole after Lion-O and saving him from falling. Selective Reasoning indeed. I'd advise you not to just throw out terms to which you aren't clear on. Believe it or not, quite a few of us on here are properly educated. (And those of us that aren't still probably recognize the value of using reference material to self educate themselves on something before speaking, which in itself is very smart.) 2. Not going to find much disagreement here, killing is typically wrong and not the most preferred course of action. However the world is never just black and white and rarely is anything that simple especially in terms of morality. What I said still stands, you used a very poor example to convey an almost absent point. You sound exactly like someone who would sacrifice a thousand people just to save someone who is important to you, and only you. That is also a very clear indiciation of an attachment issue, maybe even bordering on being possessive. 3. What you state and what you show are two different things. Much like your "do as I say not as I do" mentallity in this arguement. Hypocrits are good at that. 4. Since you asked, I will tell you. EVERYONE has been, or has felt like they have been, betrayed or hurt. Why does this one thing run your entire arguement and take up your entire view? You say you have siblings; so you've never had an arguement or caused any type of jealous, anger, hurt, or sour feelings towards one of them? I know I have been both the cause and on the receiving end of such feelings. So it feels pretty bad at the time, but just as they say things heal with time. As soon as it happens, it hurts the most, emotions are high, there is the shock factor but soon you get control of yourself and give it some thought and guess what, you keep on being siblings/friends/family. Its called forgiveness and a little bit of understanding that goes a long way. Sounds to me like you don't let go, and hold grudges for life. 5. Ah yes, the real meat and potatoes of your arguement. Basically you don't have one. You haven't really responded directly to any comment, just beaten around the bush and thrown out a few misused terms and ideas. Next course of action, blame everyone else. 6. See number 5. Not the first time I have seen you post in this thread that someone isn't understanding you. Time to take a step back and look at why people aren't understanding you. Is it the fact that what you keep saying completely conflicts with what you do? Maybe the fact that your "feelings and opinion" are based solely on one event...while you tell us to look at the series and character as a whole. Refer back to your Selective Reasoning, which I might add, is very much not "basically making excuses". Maybe it is the poor communication skills that you have? Maybe you just can't convey your thoughts correctly? Who knows, because no one understands you and apparently you are fine with that. |
Well Thunderclaw in some point you are right your exaples were quiet good but thing of something if the writers did something like putting Lion-o alone then the show it wouldn't called Thundercats but lets say Lion-os journey for example. The show it's called Thundercats and we see the journey of a group of cats trying to won against an immortal being. So we need to see the hard work between different personalities that tries to work together, leave their problems and bitterness behind so they will achieve their goals.
As you see we need to see all of them to finally accept one another before it's to late and not separeted. Don't forget that they are all under Lion-os orders so they must be united even if now it's seems impossible. |
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That is a good point. :) I did think to myself perhaps she has feelings for both brothers but since she has known Tygra longer and more closer to him than Lion-O than it would make a lot more sense why she chose him. I guess I couldn't really understand it because Tygra has never been supportive of Lion-O he since the beginning of the season he has done nothing but go against his orders and secretly harbored a deep resentment towards his baby brother since they were just young children. However, when you see the memory with Cheetara and Tygra you see that he was not always like that. |
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Personally, I don't like Tygra very much and believe that Lion-O should be with Cheetara. Not because he is Lord of the Thundercats but because he is genuine. He doesn't show one side of himself to her and then act a different way to Tygra and the rest of the group, he words hard to be the proper King but that is hard when he feels like no one is on his side. Since the series started it seemed like the only ones that were on his side was Cheetara, WilyKit and Wilycat.Tygra has always been against him it seems, and Panthro was at first but came to eventually accept Lion-O as Lord of the Thundercats. |
Someone came up with a good possibility. Mumm-Ra can shapeshift into anyone as we saw in the series premiere when he impersonated Panthro. It's possible he could impersonate Cheetara when she's kissing Tygra.
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I wish they would reveal Mumm-Ras origin,did he come from "our" earth , another dimension or what?
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Personally I'm happy with the way things worked out. Tygra and Cheetara make a cute couple...so I don't think there should be anything to break that up. There'll be more female cats out there for Lion-O (we already know Pumyra is showing up at some point). |
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Well the next episode airs this week right?
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I hope its not one of those Young Justice length stretches between episodes.
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Oh that will suck, we will end up debating the whole episode. :( never knowing what will happen next. Darn you cartoon network! Yeah, the young justice had like a three month break. I was so upset. Atleast they are working on the next set of 26 episodes.
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I think they've finished the other 13. And i'm not sure if i can get into this if they mess up the characterisation again.
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Yeah, i agree. :l keeping my fingers crossed.
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Lol wow the hype is building up indeed, if ever that is the real Cheetara making out with Tygra. Lion-O should just walk away like a boss and have the "so its like that bi*** I'mma find someone 10x hotter than you" mentality haha :p. Everything will be answered this week I hope, since apparently there's a 1 hour episode (episode 15 and 16) coming up before they break for the holidays so keep your fingers crossed :eek:
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If the show goes on a Young Justice style break , there getting one nasty email.
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I am still trying to figure what happen with Cheetara. That seemed so out of character for her to kiss Tygra. You would think she would approach Lion-o first due to him taking it harder than Tygra.
How did she know what was going on? The Elephants forget everything and they give little clues. It would be great writing in that is Mummra. Mummra use to be so awesome in the OS, they could barely beat him. I think this would not imply Mummra is gay. He is trying to get the stones and what better way to divide brothers than a women (no offense to the ladies). Mummra has been nothing so far. They wipe the floor with the kingdom and they can't beat the group. I don't understand how anyone can say Lion-o has everything. Tygra has everything, he has beat his brother in everything they do. Tygra had the fathers love and the peoples love. Lion-o has Tech, wow that is a lot. Lion-o has no kingdom too, he has to build it from nothing. I thought Cheetara liked Lion-o because he was different, not like the old guard (Tygra). He was fair and just. Lion-o showed mercy. This first arch should be called the adventures of Tygra. Lion-o has not learn anything, he only learns from painful situations. He has shown no growth in the series imo. I think any other cat that comes in and is a love interest for Lion-o cheapens the series. Cheetara is the only one for Lion-o. I thought when the women cat that helped Lion-o on the ship, when Lion-o was Leo. That the relationship between them was a foreshodowing of Lion-o's relationship with Cheetara. It was like little hints until the kiss. She encourage Lio-o, gave him kisses, and then the kiss. One thing I have learn about the writers is they are very PRO TYGRA. He has learn nothing. He knows he is better than Lion-o in everything and he won the girl. Only way he learns is he loses cheetara to Lion-o. If this series keeps going pro Tygra, I am done. Lion-o was one of my favorite character as a kid. I was ok if there was no relationship in this, but after cheetara held lion-o's hand and said they have each other, I thougth they were set in stone. I was actually happy. Tygra the true lord of the thunder cats in the writer minds. |
Everyone who thinks a kiss on the chewing is leading you on or slutty is either 12 or has not done well with women.
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The writer for this and Into The Astral Plane is pro-Tygra with him saving the Thundercats with the Thundertank, besting Lion-O in the Astral Plane, and getting Cheetara. All Lion-O has is the crown and the Spirit Stone.
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In repons to the last two posts, I think that you are reading too much into it. I believe the writers are following the comic book to the letter. In the comics, Tygra always had a resentment of Lion-O and it was never really dealt with, and whether or not anyone likes it...Cheetara was ALWAYS for Tygra. The introduction of other femailes is irrelevant right now...Lion-O has to learn to be the Lord he was destined to be.
Everything up until this point has been to show the young Lord what he would need to do to finally rid Third Earth of Mumm-ra...even losing Cheetara to his big brother. Betrayal is something that every leader should be made aware of, be able to recover from, and be able to rise above. Many on here have said that Tygra didn't betray hoim, but he did...and in doing that, Tygra may have met his downfall. The respect that Lion-o had in his brother, strained or otherwise, has been seriously damaged. It is doubtful that he will bounce back from this quickly, I feel that he will be sullen and withdrawn for a bit. Cheetara too will feel the withdrawal and I suspect that it will be a little while before they find out why he has pulled back from them. No, I don't think it'll turn into hatred, but it will strngthen Lion-O resolve to be the best that he can be...to truly be the Lord of the Thundercats. The writers aren't trying to be pro-Tygra, they are trying to give the reason why he is the way he is towards his brother. This also gives the setting for Lion-O growth as a leader that can learn from such horrible events and come out on top. |
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